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Atrocity Pay Back

The Australian has an article titled Al-Qaeda claims kill as payback and goes on to say;

AN American engineer was killed in a drive-by shooting and another US national was believed kidnapped at the weekend in Saudi Arabia in apparent retaliation for US atrocities at Baghdad’s Abu Ghraib prison.

My dictionary says;

Atrocious: adj Extremely, or shockingly wicked or cruel, heinous.
Atrocity: n The quality of being attrocious.

I’d always used the word Atrocity in connection with events like the Holocaust, the WTC fly-ins, beheading people on video, Palestinian suicide bombers blowing up woman and kids or the IRA blowing up Mountbatten. I must admit that I never though to connect it to sleep deprivation and humiliation interrogation tactics.

English is a living language and useage does change but I think it’s been kidnapped by journalists in a game of rising superlatives where the rules only apply to one side.

Under seige and loving it

As I anticipated, the Left attacked me for my post on Prisoners fair game – some with reason and beliefs but some exhibiting such vitriol that their comments say much more about them than me.

One says I make him ashamed to be Australian, accuses me of being a moral coward and signs off regards, Peter. Over at Surfdom he is much more pointed;

Kev – as an ex-servie, is probably courageous under gunfire. Alas, he’s also a bit of a moral coward. Because he considers the Iraqis so awful and terrible, he’s willing to drop the ethical bar clanging to the ground. A shame, but that’s life. (I just hope he never went above Corporal.)

Hate to dissapoint you about the Corporal bit – I went a long way past but once I was a corporal and then I was making decisions that effected mens lives and, in fact, their chances of living. It puts a perspective on life that people whose sole source of knowledge is restricted to the written word will never see.

Because he considers the Iraqis so awful and terrible

I don’t know where that line come from. Iraqi’s are OK, they’ve had a terrible time and I believe the thrust of the war will help them live better lives. So do they, actually. It’s the terrorists I hate, I have problems with terrorist of whatever nationality.

And neither am I suggesting we drop any ethical bar , I’m suggesting there are people who are not aware of where the bar rested in the first place. I’m not suggesting excessive physical violence, murder or rape are acceptable. They are not. But the methods espoused in basic Interrogation are

And now it’s plain lack of morals. Now that’s reading a lot into a short post.

Of course, there’s moral relativism and there’s just plain lack of morals.Some people get so bent out of shape because of their political prejudices that they will excuse anything because they fear their side being held accountable and perhaps losing power. And then they try and pretend that the real problem is the other side’s political prejudice, in this case suggesting that anyone who expresses concerns about our guys being the abusers isn’t really concerned about that, only in scoring political points. Talk about projection. If you want get your political arguments and moral perspective from someone who’s happy to consider dropping people out of planes in order to film them falling and dying just so they can say “up yours”, then I guess that’s your choice. I mean, you can either choose to be civilised or you can choose to behave in the same way as those you claim to despise. It’s pretty simple really.

And then they try and pretend that the real problem is the other side’s political prejudice, in this case suggesting that anyone who expresses concerns about our guys being the abusers isn’t really concerned about that, only in scoring political points.

Expressing concern is fine – but for six months? How many ways can you express concern. Should you do it every day for a year at the expense of all other stories. Is there a benchmark or is it like the Tampa/Children Overboard/ SIEV saga – everyday until someone notices that the country has gone on to other problems.

I’ve never thrown any one out of a plane and don’t intend to. I would have thought most people would see the line about tossing Osama out of a plane etc as a comment on how strongly I feel about him and his obscene crimes against humanity. Still, it’s a pleasant thought.

Whatever others think, The Abu Ghraib saga has grown out of all proportion to it’s actuall importance. It’s at risk of becoming a longer saga that the Nurembeg Trials.

I’m a sick bastard as well.

Is it permissible for me to express the heartfelt wish that sick bastards like Kev and all the others who seek to justify these crimes, one day find themselves in an Abu Ghraib or some other evil hellhole, at the mercy of similarly evil people?

“I come from a harder world”, waffles Kev. Yeah, right. We all come from the same world, you pathetic wanker. People like you just MAKE it harder.

Mate, your comment confirms we come from a different world and I don’t make it harder, I just point out that winning this battle is harder than you can imagine and it is made harder by people dwelling on one mistake and ignoring the strategy and the realities and all the other facets of the campaign.

I stand by my statement that the Left are breathing life into a carcase as they hammer at Bush and Howard.

Garrett Trooper

Garrett for preselection. Anti-US, anti-Australian, anti-capitalism, anti-politics (doesn’t vote) and anti-truth (says he did vote).

Yep. Good choice. Carmen of Amnsesia will be thrilled.

It seems both Latham and Howard are happy about Garrett joining the ALP. It occurs to me that only Howard realizes why.

As an aside, I recall during the Vietnam war the US troops had an expression Garrett Trooper. He was the guy with spit polished boots and clean fatigues that never left the base. Never at risk, never responsible for his decisions, always looking good and then went home and claimed heroic actions anyway.

From Garret or Garrett…an old military word for Barracks

Can any US Vietnam Vets confirm this? A Barry Sadlier ballad springs to mind.

Whatever, for me he will always be the Garrett Trooper, all spit polish and no substance.

Hicks charged!

Now the Left have something specific to ignore and/or rationalize

AUSTRALIAN Guantanamo Bay prisoner David Mr Hicks has been charged by the US Government with conspiracy to commit war crimes, attempted murder and aiding the enemy.

Mr Hicks is accused of returning to Afghanistan after the September 11 terrorist attacks on America in 2001 to fight against Australian and coalition troops.

How’s that for intent. After the September 11 terrorist attacks while the civilized world recoiled in horror, Hicks joins the fight against Australians and Americans.

How can any Australian support him and say they are not supporting terrorism.

On one occasion when al-Qaeda founder Osama bin Laden visited an Afghan camp, Mr Hicks questioned bin Laden about the lack of English in training material and, after accepting bin Laden’s advice, Mr Hicks “began to translate the training camp materials from Arabic to English”, the US alleged.

I’ve got to give it to him, the bastards eager to please. Let me help you kill more of my countrymen and their allies.

Mr Hicks was also allegedly interviewed by Muhammad Atef, an al-Qaeda military commander, about his background and “the travel habits of Australians”.

“It is alleged Mr Hicks armed himself with an AK-47 automatic rifle, ammunition, and grenades to fight against coalition forces.”

I’ve met a lot of men carrying AK47s in my time but I never one that I could bond with.

To help the Left formulate their rationalization strategy here are the charges.

The three charges Mr Hicks faces are:

CONSPIRACY to commit war crimes;

ATTEMPTED murder by an unprivileged belligerent; and,

AIDING the enemy.

If convicted, the prosecution will not seek the death penalty.

How’s that for Western decadance. While the Terrorists are slitting our citizens throats for prime time TV without the benefit of a crime or a trial we counter by not even seeking the death penalty.

News.com have the story here

Prisoners fair game

In the mid 60s I was a young soldier posted to the Intelligence Centre at Woodside South Australia. During the course of my time there I was detailed as staff on what was then called a Code of Conduct course. Maybe it still is, I don?t know. Young officers and NCOs would do the course to prepare them for war service so, if captured, they were at least aware of the interrogation methods of the enemy.

They would volunteer and arrive at the Intelligence Centre all ready for a week in the classroom studying Communists and other terrorist organizations.

That?s not what happened. They were put in a truck and were told they were going for a trip to look over the camp. A mile up the track the truck was ambushed, the students were captured in a very realistic and frightening manner (read shots fired, explosions, rough manhandling and rifle butts in the ribs) and they were bundled off to a camp we had built in the hills.

The role of the staff was to break these officers and NCOs within four days.

They were interrogated, forced to sleep in cells 1.5 m by 1.5 m that were designed NOT to give them a good night sleep. To small to lie down in, to low to sit up comfortably and the floor was large grade blue metal stone that neither encouraged sleeping nor sitting up.

The temperatures at Woodside in June are in single figures Celsius.

They were subject to sleep deprivation, hosed with high pressure hoses at random times like 02.30 and subject to sense disruption. The cells were blacked out so day or night was undistinguishable, and they were hooded when out of their cages, propaganda was blasted over loudspeakers at an unsafe level and they were manhandled to the point of bruising. They were stripped naked, hosed in cold temperatures and humiliated by staff.

They were subjected to trails by Kangaroo Court, found guilty and given a death sentence. One guilty man was taken outside and a shot rang out.

One of the students still inside the room feinted.

After four days they were totally disorientated and were on the verge of believing what was happening to them was real, even though they knew they were on a course.

Check out a man after 48 sleep deprivation ? he is functioning on the edge and after 72 hours the brain is loosing coordination.

Then you question him and maybe the answers save lives.

They volunteered. That?s what we do, us professionals. We are often harder on ourselves than on the enemy. We have to understand what it takes to get information out of a man that may, and often does, save lives. And we have to know how to withstand interrogation.

If you have been brought up on WW2 movies with clever interrogators outsmarting the German pilot and learning his secrets just by clever script writing then forget it. It didn?t happen that way and it still doesn?t.

This is not a profession for wimps. This is soldiering. We have to be this hard to protect our citizens against terrorism and sometimes, against themselves.

So what the hell is going on in Abu Ghraib? Nothing untoward has been stated so far. Taking a camera into the centre and snapping happy shots with sexual connotations was pretty stupid but that?s about it.

You see, the end does justify the means. Outside of murder or permanent damage; sense and sleep deprivation, some ego destroying humiliation and just a little bit of biff is OK while it saves lives. If you don?t like it – if its to much for your sensitive liberal upbringing then don?t read about it. just let us get on with trying to save your over protected indulgent self. I don?t mind if you have led a protected life and think these things that happen in war are so? well ..so terrible. Just let the soldiers do what they have to do.

You think Abu Ghraib is all about human rights?

You?re wrong.

Abu Ghraib is all about an attack on Bush and Howard. The suffering of the poor dears in prison is of no import to the left. Don?t kid yourself that they feel for them. They only care about the damage it can do the US.

And while we?re on the subject, why is it that the International Rules of War only apply to us Westerners?

If we apply these so called rules to war then we are condemned to fail. The media demand the US behave like Amnesty International undergrads and don?t even talk of WTC or the USS Cole or a dozen other obscenities. The Terrorists can blow up our woman and kids but we can?t soften up Iraqi thugs for interrogation to try and prevent it happening again. The Taliban decapitate woman for adultery and we can?t lock up Hicks, a Taliban soldier, for volunteering to kill Coalition forces. He could have been in a position to kill an Australian and although he was most probably not professional enough to succeed, he would have tried.

The left argue for a set of conditions and rules that flies in the face of every thing that happens in war. They demand the military be nice and humane to the Iraqi thug while the young soldier guarding him has just came back on watch after viewing Nick Berg?s 30 seconds of fame. Read him a bedside story, Sergeant, and tuck him in.

There were no rights in 1944 and Allied and Axis troops were shot dead on sight over the first few days of the invasion ? armed or not ,and I don?t blame them. It was that attitude that gave us the freedoms we have today ? the ones we are fighting for.

It sure as hell wasn?t anything that a Human Rights lawyer said or did.

As indicated earlier I come from a harder world. While others of my generation were getting high on weed and giggling over Marx, quoting Mao Tse Dung, and having fun supporting the enemy at Moratoriums I was picking up the pieces of their insanity and listening to the headman of a village weep over his wife and daughter raped, sliced and diced on the orders of a Marx/Ho Chi Minh inspired and Western Press supported political commissar.

Myself, I would give serious consideration to free-falling Osama Bin Laden from an aircraft at a height roughly equivalent to that distance people fell from the upper floors of the WTC. I would have the DZ fenced and populated by pigs and I would video the whole fall and the aftermath and offer the tape to AL Jazira.

Transmit this, you bastards!

Why we do it.

Amos, a Tim Blair reader left a comment on Tims post about Dick Morris titled TRIANGULATE THIS. You should go to the post and scroll down to the comment but if your a gentle type and don’t like others using strong language I have edited the comment and included it below.

Since you ask I’ll tell you why we invaded Iraq: because Afghanistan will never be anything but a bandit-ridden hellhole, but Iraq is one of the centres of the muslim clutural world, the seat of the old Bahgdad calphate and the second biggest Shia muslim concentration in the ME after Iran.

A democracy in Afghanistan will last only as long as the vareous illiterate warlords are being terrorised or bribed into line, but a democracy taking roots in Iraq will transform utterly the entire middle east.

This is why absolutly every terrorist organisation, every Muslim dictatorship and every sleezy, oil-grubbing UN rep scumbag and his lawyer are trying to stop it. Democracy in Iraq is their death-kneil.

If Dubya pulls this off he will have achieved in under a decade what the worlds vareous hand-wringing internationalist do-gooders and their bleating flocks of useful idiots in the media would not have achieved in a million years- the world’s first Arab democracy and the beginnings of the emergence of millions of people from medieval tyranny into the modern age.

I’ve said it before. Amos has said it. All evidence supports it but we’re still looking for WMDs and I note the ABC tonight are running what must be it’s 423rd expose of the Abu Graib torture series.

Some people just cannot see the big picture.

AMWU predicts disaster for Australia

The Australian Manufacturing Workers Union maintain that the FTA currently being debated and due for implimentation by January 05 will cost the Australian economy almost $50 billion and up to 200,000 jobs.

I think a closer look at the Terms of Enquiry for the study would tell us that National Institute of Economic and Industry Research (NIEIR) were told to look into the ramifications of a Latham/Crean government getting hold of the keys to the Treasury.

Thats the only event that could cost this country so much money and so many jobs.

Still, go and read it and try and work out there maths.

I can’t.

Social Engineering – ABC style

Imre Salusinszky has the best take on Play School trying to change the world order with their insane alternative life-style presentation of a lesbian couple with an immaculately conceived child being presented as normal.

George: Hello? Welcome to George’s Needle Exchange! Can I help you?

Monica: Yes please! Big Ted has used up all his needles. And because he used an infected needle, he has a sore on his arm.

George: Oh dear! Better go down to emergency and have that fixed up!

Monica: We’re on our way there right now. And we have some storybooks to read while we wait ? 100 storybooks, in fact, because we know there will be so many infected bears waiting in front of Big Ted to see the doctor.

George: Oh dear. Well, you give me those needles, Big Ted, and here are five clean ones to make sure you don’t get sick again.

Monica: Thanks Mr Needle Exchange. Big Ted will be much happier now that he has clean needles.

Well, I think it’s funny. Go read if you haven’t already done so

Mother Boards

Due to my computer’s mother board noticing the expirey of it’s warranty I had to have another one installed with the result that I didn’t collect my emails from Thursday thru Monday.

Monday, issued with new passwords I pressed the send/receive and went and made coffee.

Wow. 382 emails! So many friends. Obviously some correspondents were old girlfriends with thinly veiled comments of a personal nature and just as clearly some others (with male names) were old old drinking mates who failed to believe my juvenile boastings on conquests – why else would they suggest chemical enhancement for my libido?

Jordan, I can’t remember where I knew him, suggested my girlfriend would thank me big time. If such a person existed she wouldn’t thank me after my wife had sliced and diced her and posted her home in a small post bag. Still, maybe he doesn’t know I got married.

Worse to come – I have to talk to Telstra Bigpond Technical Help. 23 minutes to get past the gatekeeper with her inane, repetitive waffling and then the Indian accented;

“Good morning sir, how can I be helping you”

Stay cool, Kev. Don’t waste 23 minutes.

The Gipper has gone

We win and they lose.

Ronald Reagon getting the USSR problem down to one line. Far too simplistic for the left but it worked.

By the end of his watch the wall had come down. The obscenity that was Communist USSR joined the civilized world.

There will be a lot written and spoken over the next week or two. The left will call him simple and dumb. The rest of us know he changed the world for the better.

Crenkhoff has the best take.

He was behind the wall.

Duty done – Rest in Peace.

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